Seeing that now my dad has now dicided in big gun over small... i was wondering what ships ( or type of ships ) are good from big gun combat...
Well, in Big Gun the best starter ships are the 35,000 ton "treaty" battleships. These ships are spacious and fast, and have big guns and heavy armor. They're not too tight like the dreadnoughts, or too big like the 45,000 ton+ battleships. They are survivable and powerful. Basically, what you get when you build one is a respectable ship that will always have an effect on the pond. If all you ever build is a single "treaty" battleship for Big Gun, you would be set for life. A few other benefits: 1) building a treaty battleship is good practice for future additions to the fleet, be it a smaller cruiser/destroyer or a bigger battleship. 2) Treaty battleships have a shallow learning curve, in that you can survive most of the mistakes you make while you are learning. A few downsides: 1) building a battleship for your first ship (especially a big gun ship) is rather expensive, and you *will* make a few mistakes along the way. 2) As a battleship, you will attract attention from opponents, no matter your skill level. You will be forced to learn how to fight, and fight well. My ship recommendations: USS South Dakota, HMS King George V, or DKM Scharnhorst. these three ships are solid "treaty" battleships. SoDak has incredible maneuverability and 1/4" triple turrets, which makes it my personal favorite. KGV isn't quite as maneuverable, but it gets more guns in quadruple turrets, which is notorious for taking chunks out of opponents, rather than clean holes. Scharnhorst has the lightest armament of the three, but it can almost match the SoDak in maneuverability, plus Scharnhorst is quite a bit faster. I started my career in a Scharnhorst, and I had no problem taking on other battleships.
So By Treaty that makes NC a Good big gun ship? King Jorge would cool... but i dont think they sell any fiberglass hulls... on a second note: BDE cannons sells triples... but not for 1/4 ball bearings... DO i have to settle for the next best thing if they dont make cannons that shoot 1/4?
BDE cannons are perfectly capable of firing 1/4" balls, because 8/32" is the same as 1/4" (once you simplify the fraction). You just specify which caliber of shot you want when you order the cannons. The North Carolina class ship is a good big gun ship, BUT the South Dakota is so much better. The only reason the NC class is preferred in Fast Gun combat is because it's 4" longer which entitles it to go 2 seconds faster. In Big Gun combat, that speed advantage does not exist, so the shorter and more maneuverable SoDak is preferred. SoDak also has its skegs on the outside, which also helps with maneuverability.
So I should build a Sodak instead of an North Carolina because Sodaks turn beter and speed doesn't really mater? Also, what do you mean that speed doesn't really mater that much in big gun? On a second note: thanks for the little fraction help there [] i strongly dislike fractions... Oh! and i almost forgot. I got your Scuttlebutt newsletter... Very nice []
It's not that speed doesn't matter, it's that they actually go the same speed in Big Gun combat. Historically, both classes of ships went 27 knots, and so that's the speed they go in Big Gun. On the other hand, Scharnhorst goes 32 knots, and King George V goes 28 knots. Both of those ships are faster than the SoDak and NC class ships, and can choose when to fight and when not to. However, the SoDak is more maneuverable than the Scharnie and KGV, and thus has the advantage once the fight begins. You might also be interested in the HMS Lion class of WWII. It's based on the King George V class, but with improved propulsion and 9x 1/4" guns in three triple turrets, as opposed to the KGV's 10x 7/32" guns in two quadruple and one double turrets.
Now... how do you come up with big gun speed? are you saying that these 1/144 ships are going the same speed as the real model? [8)]
that would be sweet!! anyways dont you do like how many secs it takes to go 100ft and the secs would be the nots in reall life?
The "second" system used by fast gun clubs is arbitrary and based on the length and class of the ship. The Big Gun format uses a speed chart that scales down the historical ship's maximum speed. A ship that sailed at 25 knots is allowed to go the equivalent of 25 knots, which comes out to 45 seconds per 100 feet OR 1.33 full scale knots. The Giussano class cruiser Barbiano achieved 42.05 knots on sea trials. By the time WW2 rolled around, it could only achieve about 30 kts due to poor maintenance and age, but all ships of the Giussano class are allowed to go 42.05 kts on the Big Gun speed chart, including my brothers cruiser Luigi Cadorna. The speed chart can be found in any big gun ruleset. Some clubs with the rules online include the WWCC, NTXBG, and AUSBG. You can find the full chart at any one of their websites. The fast gun speeds are much greater than in big gun. The slowest dreadnoughts go 28 seconds, which comes out to about 40 kts Big Gun. The fastest destroyers go 21 seconds, which clocks in at about 54 knots. The slower speed of the big gun ships means you don't need high-power motors and expensive speed controllers. It also reduces the damage done in collisions and gives you more time to maneuver to avoid a collision.
I've found that my brother's big-gun NC out-turns SoDaks, perhaps because he runs all four props, or something to do with the shape of the hull. Some SoDaks here use all four shafts, some only two and we don't use drag disks, they are regarded as just another complication. The WWII Lion of Michael Raue is regarded as one of the most lethal ships in the Ausbg, a combination of great skippering and a powerful, reliable ship. Michael makes hulls here too, and will export them.
I'd imagine the difference in turning between an NC and a SoDak comes down to the builder. I've always been told that the skegs on the inside assisted in turning, as opposed to the SoDak version. The bottom line is, SoDaks and NCs are both available from BC, so build whichever one you like best. I personally think that SoDaks look a little cooler, but the NC class USS Washington is my favorite treaty BB, so its kind of a wash. Also, in reality, the NC is a knot faster then a SoDak. The NC's were capable of 28 knots while the SoDaks were only 27 knot ships. That being stated, 1 second isn't a big deal either way. I think Conways may only give NC credit for 27 knots although most other resources I have looked at credit her for 28. Since you guys allow hypotheticals in Big Gun, has anyone built the "as designed" NC with 12 14" in 3 quad turrets? I'd think that it was superior to a KGV in every aspect. Mike D
Yes somebody built an "as designed" NC with the 12x 7/32" cannons, but he switched to the "as completed" version because he preferred the underwater penetrating power of the 9x 1/4" cannons.
Michael is not part of BSY, but a stand-alone hull builder. He makes a range of hulls, starting with a tiny tug and progressing up to Yamatos and liners, like his impressive Titanic....that thing is huge. I'm not sure of his exact inventory, but he does make all the usual suspects.
Darren is 100% correct. My North Carolina out turns and accelerates to speed faster than any Sodak it has encountered.The firepower is the same so some caution must be exercised when battling.As far as appearance...beauty is in the eye of the beholder ...which means that I really dont like the look of a Sodak (my choice only).I find that the shape of the skegs and the overall hull makes for a better handling ship Tony Scott..
I'm not surprised. Internal weight distribution and good construction technique have at least as much to do with turning ability as the ship's prop and rudder arrangement. And yes, beauty is definitely in the eye of the beholder. To me, firepower is beautiful, and the only NC in my club is unarmed No amount of paint and detail could make a ship like THAT pretty. On the other hand, there is a beautiful USS Wisconsin that I've been trying to sink for the past three years. I haven't succeeded yet but I'm sure I'll get him next time!
