So I'm genuinely curious about this since I've heard from past participants in this hobby that the current state of the hobby is way too competitive with modern tech like brushless, high power pumps, and energy dense batteries. With that being said, I'm genuinely curious what the mentality out there is. Is the hobby becoming less fun? What are your concerns with advances in technology? Or any changes that you think effect the hobby in a negative way. Please be honest. I would love to hear your opinions on this.
No, it has added diversity and inclusion because many more boats are viable than previously was the case.
Ok. So as one of the "old guard" I have mixed emotions on this question. I miss the old days of ships that take the whole lake to turn around in. Phono jacks that melted. Pumps we made out of wood and pennies that pumped 1/2 gallon a minute. Fires for no apperent reason. Batteries you charged for 2 days and still ran out of juice 6 minutes into the battle. Guns that might or might not work depending on temperature, crappy copper bbs or they just compleatly froze, the whole thing. Did I mention melting wires and fires yet? I personally think we are in a much better place today. Its nice to see rookies come out and in a day or two there stuff is working and there having fun. Yes, I still have issues with new tech but like anything else, change is inevitable and you have to learn to adapt. I still love this hobby, the people in it and batteling instead of working. Plus of course spreading lies and smoking cigars.
So I sume the hobby up to people who ask as 20% battle 60% fixing 20% old school b.s. with friends. I can say you meet people you never otherwise would, play with toy boats and b#$ch they don't work but have fun doing it.
I don't think the tech like pumps and cannons and batteries is ruining the battling as much as the extra turning (huge rudders), extra thrust in one direction and the lack of attention to scale fidelility. Oh and now fantasy ships are here to make it worse. There isn't a tech tree you need to fill up with hypothetically operational ships to balance the game, guys. That said I still like the people, just not the way the battling and rule enforcement has evolved.
Care to elaborate on how increased turning ability has ruined the hobby? This hobby has always been about turning. German ships were always favorites because they spin like tops. Increased rudder sizes have made more ships turn better but definitely not enough to say all ships turn equally well and I personally don't see it as a detrimental shift. I can't see any difference in gameplay by any means.
I think the hobby has come a long way since I started in 2012~2013 with my Andrea Doria which I picked up from this very forum. It needed to have both inline rudders present, it would turn in a zip code sized circle, it accelerated "lazily" compared to a modern ship, and the guns fire rate was...limited. Ships as a whole are a lot more reliable, ships are generally more "useable" that years ago would've been immediately written off as dogfood boats. Purely "technology" and not "building methods" in my opinion can't *hurt* the hobby. Yeah, sure, maybe there aren't as many sinks due to more powerful pumps...yeah right. There's still tons of sinking. Brushless motors are generally much more reliable long term, lithium batteries are so much more power dense that its easier to build certain ships that would be very hard to build otherwise due to weight or physical space. Solenoids and gun boards are far superior to the older servo/poppet setup, as are ESC's vs servos and microswitches. Nowhere is this more apparent than on the boat I'm rebuilding right now, Salem. I battled her a few times over the last year~ exactly as she came to me with mag throttle and servo-microswitch pump control along with an ancient Swampy pump old BC breech guns. But the boat "worked" ok. You'd be right at max weight to get enough battery in it, the batteries would immediately come off their storage charge higher voltage and your speed would start to drop and now you're a 25 second Des Moines. It would pump about as hard as a leaky faucet. The guns would fire, but not quickly, because the servo that pushed on the microswitch to fire them could only move so fast. It would turn, eventually. Refit with modern tech the boat has actual throttle control, the pump actually pumps a decent amount for a 1/2 unit, the guns can fire as fast as I pull the trigger. Turning we'll find out tomorrow at sea trials. It can fit 3x the amount of battery with lipos, an absolutely silly amount in a cruiser really. As for the rules changes/"techniques" that people have found (ie bigger rudders, schilling rudders, fishtails, toed in props, etc) this is not "technology" in my opinion. People have been doing this as long as this hobby has existed in it's recognizable form. The NASCAR crew chief optimization game of how far we can push the rulebook into the grey zone to get what we want has been around forever. The fact that some of the Earnhardt tricks are now common knowledge and widely implemented shouldn't be a huge problem, it has helped bring boats that would never even been seen on the water out for people to enjoy. Some of the "unfinished' boats that people are pushing for these days are because they add something new and exciting to the hobby, when a lot of the regularly battling captains have seen it all, built it all, etc. If the people want cake, within reason, they should be allowed to eat cake.
Good question, In my opinion there are many subtle differences nowadays But the big difference today is in the batteries! In prehistoric times the ROMANS had to use Lead-acid batteries. Less on-board-power, not as flat a power curve. This meant just ONE PUMP, No changing batteries for most ships. That meant in the second sortie everyone was slower, pumps were weaker, Fewer holes to sink If you ran around TOO much you would be the slowest boat. In my opinion, boats have more complicated electronics. Now we have ESC which caused MANY problems when they were first used. I understand some people went through 5 ESC in one battle. Solenoids, firing boards, etc. Old days poppets and gears, dry-boxes. Boats where cheaper. But with the new batteries we are seeing more destroyers. As a whole I think that we have hit a stage where RELIABILITY of components is very good. Finally, 2.4 Mhz radios. Any vet. can tell you about the pros and cons of those. Having said all that, I think the hobby is as enjoyable as it ever was. A little less strategy because you can go "100 miles" on batteries and a few less sinks.
All solid points Kas, I would make the argument that 10+ years ago everything was cheaper. These days you can get a pretty darn reliable 1060 ESC for like $23. I don't think I could set up a watertight box, servo, decent switches for a mag throttle for less than that. And the cost of the boat is pennies compared to driving from Michigan to New Jersey to come battle with us, or vice versa. Heck I spent more than $20 the last time we all went out to eat.
Somebody mentioned Dale Earnhardt. I detected it. I look at it this way--I assembled a boat in a one room cabin in Alaska in six months while only reading this forum, and with my basic understanding of the technology, managed to show up at my first battle with a functional boat. that boat only missed like two sorties in its entire service lifespan due to malfunctions. I built a second boat based on the lessons learned and that boat has yet to miss a single sortie due to mechanical failure. I built a *third* boat, and it has also never missed a single sortie. I Shudder to imagine what I would have done if the tech was still a total clown show like it was back in the olden days. Praise Dale.
I agree Will that you could take an old boat and improve it. You are discounting that in the old days they all sucked. (compare NASCAR now to 20 years ago)
I don't really think those ships to which you refer make things bad. the 1920 SoDak isn't a world-beater, and the other proposed boats are all kinda okay. I haven't seen masses of folks switch over to them. But the few fellas that have them are happy with them, and they're on the water, which means I can poke holes in em. Besides, I can't really fault fellas for building the launched-but-uncompleted boats because all of my boats come from an Alternate Timeline where the formation of a standing Navy was outlawed during the constitutional convention leading the Revenue Cutter Service to assume the duties and authorities, later to become the US Coast Guard, so all of my American boats are properly listed as Cutters and painted in the USCG Livery. Further, all of my non-American boats are Canadian in this alternate timeline by virtue of either the boat being gifted to the Dominion by the Princess Royal in recognition for their gallant service to the empire, OR that they were taken in daring boarding actions by the Royal Canadian Marines. and all of those boats also sport the USCG livery by virtue of the treaty forming the North American Maritime Command in 1949 following the disastrous end of the Third World War.
The single biggest thing that modern technology has brought to the table is reliability. Our equipment is vastly more reliable now than it was a decade ago, and that's a very good thing. I'm not a fan of the pump wars or some other aspects of the hobby as it currently stands, but it is very nice that I can slap some balsa on my ship, throw batteries and bottle in, and know that I'll have a ship that drives, shoots, and pumps. I'm basically guaranteed to have a fun day at the pond no matter how many times I sink because I'll know that I earned those sinks.
But with the new batteries we are seeing more destroyers. As a whole I think that we have hit a stage where RELIABILITY of components is very good. Thanks for agreeing with me!
For sure, Kas! I've been working on some really really small models lately and while a lot of them are currently just convoy boats, with the track I've been seeing, I would not be surprised if some of the Sloops, Corvettes, and DEs that I've been modeling get armed before the end of the decade. they'll be silly, but great testbeds for the more practical boats.
Now if only there was a way to cheaply and easily mass-manufacture reliable and well-functioning cannons that didn't require a garage sweatshop of forced laborers...
