OK, what happend to the Indiana Cannons ??

I'm a former MBG guy from way back and have
had many of the Bill N. cannons over the years
and i have been away form Big Gun for some time
and was wanting to get back into it. I started
looking around and NO Indiana Cannons ?? In fact
it seems there is very little available when it
comes to Cannon's ??

If i remember correct there was a Guy ( Jason ) ??
that took over making the Indiana Cannon , what happened ??

What is eveyone doing for Cannons ??

Sharky

 

The only place I know of that you can buy Big Gun cannons is here:

Visit this site


I think Carl might make some over there in Cali; but he will be able to answer that better.


BTW, welcome back! Have we met? I seem to remember someone named "Sharky"...

 

Man thats a bad deal, if these clubs want
to survive you need to have several supply
companys that can provide , Pumps, Hulls, Props,
CANNONS Etc...and have them sooner not later. It's
real easy to move on to another hobby if it's hard
to out fit a ship. Plus with this ( Big Gun ) hobby
you have to build the ship around the Guns !!!

Anyone else know of Cannon's For Sale ??

Sharky

 

I *might* in the future, but that entirely depends on how easy & effective these new (top secret) guns are.

I know battlersconnection makes fast guns... would be ok if you use a ship equiped only with BBs.

I'm still expecting carl & tuggy to chime in here....................................... Where are you guys?

 

Well, unfortunately I don't make guns I don't have the equipment or the time while I'm at college. In the WWCC, several people make cannons, and other people who need guns either get them from BDE or from the club members who make (and sell) cannons. In my humble opinion, the BDE cannons are the best of those on the market, although they occasionally need a little "spit-n-polish" before they reach optimum performance. BDE has contracted out a modular cannon design to a CNC machine shop, so everything they supply is very consistent and high quality, which is why I prefer them to the most garage-machined guns. Their prices may seem high but that's about what it costs to make a decent gun with quality parts anyway. It could be done cheaper, but reliability would suffer immensely. The only cannon maker with better guns is Neal's Garage, and he doesn't accept orders. However, if you can visit his garage, he's got the equipment and willingness to help you custom-build a set of cannons to a higher quality than even BDE can. I have two sets of cannons from Neal's Garage, and they do what they're supposed to when they're supposed to, whether they're firing sticks, stones, steel, or rusty ball bearings.
For clarification, here's the problems that sometimes need some spit-n-polish on BDE cannons:
1) the magazine tends to *jump* a little every time you fire, making consistent ranging somewhat difficult.
2) the ball valve occasionally gets stuck in the open position, wasting gas and potentially freezing the regulator.
3) sometimes the wrong (read too small) accumulator gets put on a triple or quadruple cannon, requiring higher firing pressures.
These problems are not very common (that I have seen) and are not difficult to fix. Most importantly, once they are fixed they stay fixed. Other cannon suppliers have magazines falling off the ball valve, inconsistent loading, and breakable magazine covers, in addition to higher rates and severity of BDE problems.

If you want an average battleship, then any old gun will do just fine. But you don't want an AVERAGE battleship, do you?

 

>But you don't want an AVERAGE battleship, do you?

No, but I'm sure he wants a battleship. The prices that BDE charges is WAY too high for me. I couldn't afford to fight with the prices they charge. That would bring my ship up by $600, just for the guns! Not possible for me.

In my mind the BDE guns being the only true "purchasable" big gun package is the single most limiting factor for our hobby. PERIOD.

--->Now that's not to say the BDE guns are not worth every penny. I borrowed a set once that were VERY nice & very professional. They are a very nice system, if you can afford them. I cannot, so I build.

 

That is a problem, isn't it? Everybody wants everything cheap, & nobody can produce the specialized equipment necessary for combat at prices that can actually support a business. Nobody's getting rich selling R/C warship combat parts, of any type. I've heard any number of people claim that they could produce Indiana/J.C. White cannons for a fraction of what BDE & others have charged, but to date I've never seen a single one actually do it. The materials are cheap, but it takes a lot of time to build one, even for somebody who has the equipment & skills. For the rest of us, that's just part of the cost of entry into the sport. $1000 or more really isn't that bad for a fully-armed warship, when you compare it to what people spend on planes, cars, racing boats, etc.

JM

 

You are 100% right (as usual), John. But that still does help those that don't have the $1000 to spend on trains, planes, boats, or automobiles. Without the price of cannons, the ship is fairly easy to swallow. With a lot of hard work & second hand stuff, it should easily ring in under $400. This $ range is standard for any hobby.

We know that maintenence for boats is no where near the cost of supporting a R/C car or plane... The majority of the cost of the "other" hobbies is the 10,000 small $5 plastic pieces that keep breaking. So in the long run, a warship is by far cheaper.

Small Gun cannons are roughly $34/barrel.... so for an Iowa... $300 in cannons, plus you figure roughly $120 in pneumatics parts & regs & bottles... $420 is still quite expensive.

PLEASE DON'T MISUNDERSTAND ME, BDE & Battlers makes great stuff! & their prices (I'm sure) are just above manufacturing costs... So there is nothing they can do. However, it still doesn't change the fact that it is expensive to create a boat.


If only there was a way to strap a gerbil to the boat who would throw little BBs at enemy boats... That could cut costs down! The only real problem is training a gerbil which boats are axis. []




---- As far as pumps, props, rudders, motors, batts, hulls... they are relatively easy to find & are cheap. Hulls are probably the most expensive @ $100-200.

 

I'm still waiting for my cannons to be done from BDE (its been 2 months now). Anyone out there who battles Big Gun, and has a machine shop set-up with the know how to build guns should definately consider it. Just having one supplier makes it hard on everyone (including the supplier, who I'm sure has more things going on than this) and slows up the process of getting more boats to the pond. Durring high school I worked at a local machine shop and still remember a lot (I tend to write important stuff down) and would give gun building a try. But that has to wait until I buy a house, just not enough room where I am at the moment.

 

Here in Canada the conversion of the currency and the shipping costs make BG way too expensive for anyone here to try out the sport. Fast gun alone is expensive but it is workable for us Northern Barbarians.

 

I'm afraid that your legal fees, to defend against PETA suits, would cost even more!

That's why I came up with the "$150 Rule" to estimate costs for building Big Gun warships:

- $150 for a fiberglass hull
- $150 for a radio
- $150 for each armed turret
- $150 for a CO2 delivery system (fittings, tank, regulators, etc.)
- $150 for misc. items (motors, fittings, wiring, etc.)

Sometimes more, sometimes less, but it's a quick "ballpark" estimating tool. Using this rule, a typical 3-turret warship should cost about $1050 which, in my experience, is pretty close. Money can be saved in several areas by doing the work oneself. Having reasonable expectations from the start can go a long way toward preventing disappointment later.

JM

 

So would I if I had unlimited supplies of time & money. I've talked to lots of people who would, if they could. Sadly, life gets in the way...

Lottery winners & others with loads of excess cash, take note: If you need to start a business for tax write-off purposes (i.e. don't need to make a profit, want to take advantage of capital equipment depreciation, etc.) here's a great opportunity!

JM

 

Jason Annen took over production several years ago from Bill N. Jason isn't as involved as he used to be, but still runs batches on occasion. What exactly are you looking for cannon wise? I can check with him to see if he has any availible. You can email me at andy@roeske.us.

Andy

 

PETA never has to know!! Any dead animals will go down with the ship! [:0]
*No animals have been hurt in the creation of this thread.*

That's not a bad system; for what corners you can cut on one part, one of the others will make up for.

There is no getting around it. Hobbies are expensive.

 

The way I figure, the cost of getting (and maintaining) a machine shop capable of building good cannons is more than the cost of building ANY warship, so whatever money you save by building your own cannons goes into maintaining the equipment you need to build them. If you already own or can access a good machine shop (or know someone who can) then building your own guns can save a lot of money, but otherwise its actually cheaper to get them from BDE.

 

How true. One would almost certainly have to justify the equipment for some other purpose(s) as well. That, or have SO MUCH excess cash lying around that it doesn't matter.

JM

 

Tug, I'm going to be trying to make some sliding breech guns over at a friends shop sometime in the near future (for my 3rds) They'll be of the BB, rotating w/ depresion variety. So if they work, I'll make enough for myself, Matt and you if thats something you're interested in.

 

Hurrah Tuggy's coming back!! No more stupid schooling stuff.