How have Big Gun Mogamis been armed to date? Mains and/or Torpedoes? Triple bb or twin 3/16? Has anyone successfully armed all three front mains? Has anyone built a Fast Gun rotating triple bb? I have two Mogami hulls to arm. I've been leaning towards Torpedo only, because it seemed technically less challenging. I am open to options, though. Eric
Torpedos only would get my vote. Arming the mains in big gun adds considerable complexity for minimal combat effectiveness, since they can only fire bbs. If you can get torps in there and have room to burn afterwards (not likely), then look into additional armament.
Rotating triple guns of the usual fast gun style would be difficult given the manner in which the magazines are typically built and arranged. Long tubes can't really do more than a few degrees of pivot, and the coil shapes occupy enough exclusive volume that you would need to get pretty clever to fit 3 in a rotate (maybe arrange them in a cloverleaf. If you want to arm the mains you might consider fixed point of aim triples though, it would reduce your volume requirements and complexity, and might be semi doable. You could range them out further than the torpedoes and use them as harassment weapons. Not overly familiar with big-gun speed and rudder rules though, you may not have the speed and maneuverability required for that.
Yeah, I haven't come up with any arrangement for the front mains that wouldn't cause a cruiser to roll over when the barrels swung out for a broadside. And, Torpedoes are easier to build. My observation has been that Big Gun cruisers with mains usually end up as cargo ship hunters/defenders. Jeff's (NTXBG) USS Dallas being an exception. He spent the last NABGO I attended harassing my VFS Verdun mercilessly. It was also a comment on his Captaining skills versus mine. Four triple Torpedo mounts would make a cruiser an all purpose ship-killer. There used to be a Kitakami in the MBG with 36 armed Torpedo barrels. As I recall, it was very effective until it was recognized as a BB-killer, then it was treated as a low-displacement, lightly-armored BB.
I'm a couple days late on this one because I was rebuilding my computer, but here's my two cents worth. My thoughts on arming the Mogami are based on my experiences with the light cruisers that were used as torpedo boats in WWCC (Capitani Romani, Spahkreuzer, Giussano, Kitakami, Atlanta). The WWCC limited torpedo tubes to a maximum of three per side, but these weapons were still highly effective at hunting and (especially if in a coordinated group) killing anything on the water. Torpedo cruisers liked to go after disabled targets, cargo vessels, and other easy targets. They could run in under the guns of an unprepared battleship and get a free shot while any return fire bounced harmlessly off the deck. While a torpedo cruiser that had shot its load was considered a good target, it was considered suicidal to attack an armed torpedo boat. Each ship had even odds of getting crippled, and torpedo cruisers preferred to attack from a position of advantage with favorable odds. To deal with the threat posed by those torpedo boats, several ships were investigated as possible torpedo-boat-destroyers. One set of torpedo-boat-destroyers were actual destroyers: Z-25, Tashkent, Shimakaze, Navigatori, Fantasque. Their smaller size and greater speed would give them the maneuverability edge over the larger cruisers and, more importantly, make them harder targets. They would be armed with a single torpedo tube firing three balls, which simulated a triple torpedo cannon in a much smaller package that could fit into a smaller boat. This single tube torpedo cannon generally did not cause the massive damage of the full triple torps, but was still a very effective weapon. Kotori built and ran a Z-25, which he used to hunt larger cruisers and spoil their attacks on his friendly ships. Torpedo cruisers wanted nothing to do with him because he was a hard target to hit, and had a strong bite in return. Mogami falls into the other set of proposed torpedo-boat-destroyers: "super cruisers." These were heavy cruisers armed with both torpedoes and cannons, like Mogami and Kirov. The idea was to retain the killer punch of triple torpedoes while adding either a fixed or rotating cannon in the bow. The cannon added flexibility to engagements. Most importantly, it enabled the super cruiser to chase down a torpedo cruiser and plink away with the cannon from beyond torpedo range. Even just a few hits would put the torpedo cruiser in serious trouble. One guy built a Haguro armed with torpedoes and a single rotating cannon, but he never really got the cannon working well. He mostly operated as an oversized torpedo cruiser that was easier to hit and less maneuverable. I have yet to see a proper super cruiser in action. If you are not in the WWCC, you are not limited to three tubes per side. You can double that to six per side, per historical. This means more firepower, but the cannons will take up more space and probably preclude the use of a forward cannon per the super cruiser plan. Personally, I found three tubes plenty enough to allow torpedoes to have a strong place on the battlefield without being a one-shot-wonder. I would go with a single rotating double or triple cannon in the bow coupled with a pair of triple torpedoes.
When I joined WWCC back in 2002, one of the most-feared captain/ship combos in the club was a guy named Ken Safer and his Mogami. Ken would patrol back and forth, just out of range of big gun "special delivery" cannon fire, waiting for an opportunity to pick off a sitting duck, or severely wounded or otherwise engaged enemy ship. He would run in, bow guns plinking away every 4 seconds, make a hard turn to come alongside his victim, fire his torpedoes, then run back out to sea, and back on patrol. In addition, Ken had a perfectly legal "listing device" installed in his Mogami, controlled from the TX, with which he was able to tilt his impenetrable deck toward any threat as he ran in and out. Steel balls bounced off it. When asked how he chose when to attack, Ken replied that it was all about profit and loss: as long as he was certain that he could inflict more damage than he would likely absorb, then it was a go; if not, then remain on patrol. Rob
You guys started me thinking along a new track, that I like. Previously, I'd only thought in terms of all Mains or all Torps. Now, I'm thinking forward Mains and 2x triple Torps. Sounds like Ken was running triple bb cannon. How many of the three forward turrets did he get armed? Eric
The best configuration for a Mogami I have seen was one rotating triple in the bow, and a five-round-magazine reloading triple torpedo launcher off each side. With its speed and maneuverability (twin rudders, excellent weight distribution), it could outrun anything it couldn't outgun. The rotating bow gun gave it a ton of versatility against lightly-armored targets, and the torpedoes were effective against heavily armored targets. It only had two problems: old balsa, and old electronics. On its first post-refit battle, it was run down by a disgruntled Romani and its ten-year-old balsa shattered under the impact of six 1/4" rounds. The ten-year-old electronics fried, and the skipper moved on to other builds instead of repairing it. Still, he identified and covered the key points of a super-cruiser. Heavy torpedo armament, to provide a high-probability kill shot. A rotating multi-barrel cannon, to add versatility against smaller ships. Light weight superstructure (he used 1/32" balsa) and good internal weight layout, for stability. And not overloading his ship, like most other super-cruisers tried to do. Although he had the option of putting in a much heavier armament, he went with sufficient firepower, and used the free space and weight to make his ship easier to work on. Of course, he was still building to 1980's standards and this was in 2007...
Hmmm, I don't know if I have enough self-control to arm only one of the forward turrets. I might have to get "burned" first.
do the mags for the rotating gun only come in one size?. If they don't i would go with second smallest size and use more than one of them. Two in front one in back, or how ever you could go about doing it. Because the gun size can vary for ships, right? so use one that wouldn't make it roll over when rotating them. If it comes to that point. With that combo small mags and small barrel size you could fit more smaller ammo inside, right? Then if there is space and if its legal to do within the rules add torps. Maybe I don't know what i'm talking about but i think it might work after a few attempts at it. I will try if no one will once i get my first ship on the go.
since Big Gun cannons are almost entirely custom-made, you can make magazines of whatever size fits. I've seen them as small as 1.5" dia and as large as 6" dia, it all depends on what you specifically need and what you can make. Just be aware that, for cruiser-sized ships, magazine size isn't the limiting factor, it's accumulator size. Arranging these large accumulators to support multiple working turrets in a cruiser-sized warship is complex, and makes maintenance and repairs extremely difficult.
