Well, with that in mind how about getting a pocket battleship? The Deutschland/Lutzow, Graf Spee, and other ships of the class aren't not exactly speedboats, but they're heavy-cruiser-sized AND they've got large-caliber rotating guns. Furthermore, you can buy a fiberglass hull from any of several sources and buy two triple cannons and 9-oz CO2 bottle from BDE, and that covers most of the stuff you need. Unless you have the tools to build your own cannons, you will need to buy them anyway, and there aren't any places I know of that sell torpedo cannons.
If you want a British cruiser, then HMS Belfast might be a good choice, considering she's sitting in the Thames...
I would verify the laws on air guns in the Union of British Socialist Republics before arming a battleship. It'd be a shame to go to all that effort and be locked up. I believe this has been the roadblock in the past and the laws have not gotten less restrictive in the last decade.
Hi all, You guys are not seriously suggesting that a newbee build a cruiser are you!?? Yes, it is about combat, BUT for new guys a merchant is a quick and EASY way into the hobby and acts as a great way in learning a lot of construction stuff. The added complexity and cost of a ship with guns, especially if it doesn't work well the first time, will almost certainly put people off. More so if they don't have any people with expertese to assist them. Cruiser due to their smaller size and weight considerations are exponentially harder again than battleships to get right. I have battled a DKM Kormoran for 6 years now and it rarely gets sunk (about once or twice a meeting) and it is a lot of fun. A merchant ship also is quick to get on the pond and start sailing ASAP. Peter H
Alot of us battle fast gun, and we seldom use non firing ships. One of the larger cruisers, or a 4 unit ship in fast gun are not too hard to put together, and will get a person involved right away. Most of the fast gun clubs will pitch right in and have build sessions to help beginners. And from what I see the big gun clubs will do the same, but since I do not battle big gun, I cannot tell you what a good starter ship would be.
What I don't understand is how you big gun guys can in good conscience recommend an unarmed ship for beginners. It's akin to inviting someone to go deer hunting with them, then informing them they are the deer.
Mike, Sorry, but I am in agreement with Peter. It is a common recommendation in Big Gun to go with a merchant first (I actually followed that advice, while most jump in with both feet into an armed ship). I have a ball with my transport, by the way, and after 5 years have just gotten around to collecting the bits to start building an armed ship or two. Though I could arm two of my merchants (one pretty easily with a Small Gun cannon or a Model Armory cannon or even an Arizona gun - all of which I have in stock), I have not. My son drives a Dunkerque, so I have an armed ship available, but, frankly, while I have maintained it, I have never driven it. A beginner can learn a lot from a transport in Big Gun. In Small/Fast Gun, of course, your mileage may vary. Keep in mind that the AusBG only scores convoy runs now, not other damage as I understand it (in fact, I am not sure they even score sinks). We do the same in the Convoy is King scenario battle at NABGO. And, historically, the underlying purpose of a navy was to protect (or destroy) the convoys, was it not? Cheers,
[:0] Now the deer suit you sent me makes cense crazy I’m shipping it back you can go deer hunting by your self []
What I don't understand is why fast gun clubs don't run transports more often. They can be lent out to skippers whosse boats are having problems, or to get new members on the pond who don't yet have their own boat. They also teach basic ship handling and repairing skills. Best yet, they give the skipper a stake in the battle, so instead of seeing a mess of ships blasting each other the skipper starts to develop his battlefield awareness and notice who is coming after him. potential recruit who shows up at a battle has already taken the bait. Let him try the battle for himself (even as a target) and you can really set the hook deep. My brother and I started by borrowing a pair of transports, so I know the idea is successful. Do fast gun clubs allow transports a pump? I seem to recall that transports are usually gigantic passenger liners with a lot of reserve buoyancy, which suggests they have little or no damage control.
No, fast gun transports are completely unarmed and have no damage control. The small gun clubs typically dislike the convoy battles, so transports are never run. Nothing seems to cause more hate and discontent in the small gun clubs then the convoy battles do. We often do have ships that we loan out to new guys, but they are normally warships. Small and simple yes, but those captains can get in and mix it up without feeling like they have a bullseye painted on their back. The only thing a small gun captain is likely to learn from a convoy is how to patch, and how to sink close to shore. Hopefully they have previously leared how to waterproof their electronics. I can certainly understand why jumping in with both feet to a battleship is not recommended, but I can't understand why big gun guys don't recommend simple warships with only one or two cannons. The weapons are really the only thing that sets our ships apart from scale ships that simply drive around. If you were to get new guys out there in small, fast ships with a gun or two (nothing says those ships have to be FULLY armed) I'd bet they have a lot more fun then running around in a slow tanker with capital ships trying to pound them. I did a transport my first year. I was also loaned a small dreadnought, the USS Michigan. The Liberty ship got hammered. It wasn't any fun. The Michigan also go hammered, but you know what? I had a lot of fun. At least I could defend myself. That little warship set the hook far deeper then the transport did. Heck if the transport was all I ever ran, I may not have stuck around.
Because there is more honor is sinking a NC than in sinking an LST. While the ultimate goal of controlling the oceans is to allow unhindered commerce, I don't recall a large number of transports involved at Jutland. Also, it's hard enough to get that first ship on the water, it might as well be something that can hit back. Fast gun ships are far less complex than big gun.
>>Fast gun ships are far less complex than big gun. Ummm, the majority of the ship is the same until getting to weapons and possibly motors. (BigGun doesn't require heavy duty wiring or as high rated ESC's/switches as the Small/Fast Gun ships do). The ships with Arizona Guns are less complex since there isn't any breeches to continually adjust on the guns. The ones with Indiana cannons have rotation to worry about during constuction which isn't that big of a deal, but that is easier than continually adjusting the o-ring breeches. Course, I'm used to Big Gun, so it could be that to me it is less complex than fast gun, and you are thinking the same thing in reverse. Battling without convoy ships seems like a waste though. What's the point if there isn't *some* sort of goal. Convoys were never sexy, but without them, ships wouldn't have supplies. We've been doing battles lately where the only points that matter are the convoys, and the damage/sink points aren't counted. It actually leads to more and GREATER carnage as convoy defense and attack takes priority over ship to ship engagement. The result is more combat ships get sunk and normally timid captains get kinda ferocious. Convoys can be a lot of fun.
I enjoy campaign. However, fleet battle expresses what is best in life. To crush your enemies, to drive them before you, and hear the lamentation of the women.
I suspect the reason why many Fast Gun guys don't like the campaign battles is because they are way too darned complex. I remember reading the rules awhile ago, and there were restrictions as to how many ships could be near a convoy ship, how and when they could attack, and all sorts of other icky, confusing, and mostly pointless stuff there. I can certainly understand why people wouldn't like that. It'd be hard enough to figure out what all those rules mean in the first place, remembering them while you're trying to attack a pair of transports under heavy escort is probably even tougher. Is that an accurate description, or did I miss something? As Yamatoman has said, fleet battles are fun because you get to crush your opponents, drive them before you, and hear the lamentation of the women. Convoy battles are a different flavor of fun. It's kinda like being the little guy making a dash for a touchdown while the linemen clash around you, followed by blowing a loud, wet raspberry at the big bad battleship skippers who failed to sink you while you slip past their blockade and into safe harbor.
In our club (NTXBG), convoys (armed or not - most not) are a part of every battle, not just separate "campaign" scenarios. Even the Texas Cage Match at NABGO. My little Lake Shore came in 4th overall in the Texas Cage Match in 2006, and was last unarmed ship standing. Beat out several armed ships. The raspberry factor is not to be minimized - it is a lot of fun. You learn a lot from building and running a convoy - about construction, about maneuvering, about maintenance and repair, about situational awareness, about the capabilities of other ships/captains, etc. It is a wonderful learning tool. IF they are used. I have had so much fun with mine, that I have felt no need to go armed. Yet. After all, someone has to be the mouse to the cat. But, different clubs, different philosophies and personalities. One really fun scenario we had was that every captain had to run a convoy at least 2 laps per hour (or something like that) to also run his battleship. Made for some "when do I hit the pit" in a "NASCAR sense" decisions. Cheers,
