USS Phoenix (CL-46)

Discussion in 'Warship Builds' started by Litch42f, Jul 5, 2018.

  1. Litch42f

    Litch42f Well-Known Member

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    My very first boat in this hobby was a Swampworks Brooklyn that I got in high school. Of course at the time I had really no idea how to build a combat ship. I had done a few regular RC boat builds with my dad but that was it. The result was a hardly legal boat that took 15 feet to turn and shot maybe once in a while.

    Once I heard about Strike closing down I decided to grab another Brooklyn hull and, like a Phoenix, breath new life into a childhood project (CL-46 also has some interesting history) The Phoenix would serve several purposes: to provide a backup ship to my current Invincible, to hone my skills with the newer combat technologies (solenoids, solid state electronics, etc) and to provide for some "dual stern run and gun fun".

    The build has already moved quite far along but Ill try and make several posts of the journey so far. Perhaps this thread will help out some fellow new-comers that may also be interested in a basic cruiser build using mostly commercial-off-the-shelf items. The only advantage I might have over some other new builders is a basic 3d printer, but most of the things I print are simple and can be replicated by hand.

    Started off with some float testing and waterline marking in the dirty pool.

    waterline.jpg

    Figured out the appropriate number of 1/4" ribs although I changed around the spacing a few times. I grouped them a little closer in the bow to help with the curvature and to maybe prevent a few aboves from getting covered by the bow wave. I got 3/8" tape for the weather deck from Amazon and the 1/4" tape from a hobby store.

    Phoenix rib marking.jpg

    Drilled my corners and started working on cutting the windows out.

    Phoenix window holes.jpg

    Phoenix half windows.jpg

    Although I was cutting fiberglass in my enclosed garage I was wearing a full face respirator and had enough dexterity to keep a vacuum intake pinched between my legs to suck up a lot of the dust.
     
  2. Litch42f

    Litch42f Well-Known Member

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    So I still haven’t fully committed to a battery type for the Phoenix. I initially bought a 5 aH 6v SLA with plans on running those but in the spirit of this build I should try and use a newer chemistry. I’ve seen a few people use the two 3.2v 10aH LiFe cylindrical cells in series.

    http://www.batteryspace.com/lifepo4...gerate32whwith6mscrewterminal-unapproved.aspx

    The size is right and would be plenty of amp-hours. However when I was looking through the specifications .pdf it specifically stated to avoid water with the battery. I think I saw one build thread where someone coated the ends of the cells with some type of spray on electrical coating. I’m assuming someone has run these successfully before?
     
  3. WillCover

    WillCover -->> C T D <<--

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  4. Litch42f

    Litch42f Well-Known Member

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    For today's upload of build progress on the Phoenix we have the rudder setup. I wanted to try using gears for this as I was tired of using linkages. I sat down with the BC gear set, a Hobby King waterproof servo and my calipers and began designing a one piece rudder shaft and servo mount. If I could combine everything and got the measurements correct I shouldn't have to worry about the gear meshing becoming too loose. So here was my first attempt seen below the keyboard on the right:

    IMG_20180320_151012099.jpg

    My printer didn't exactly print what I had designed... After some nozzle cleaning and a watchful eye I tried again. The first successful print ended up putting the servo and gear combo too high in the hull so I had to do a little adjusting to the design to make the servo sit lower. Eventually I got something that worked:

    rudder gear.jpg

    A standard brass tube runs up through the hull and through the printed mount. I took some material off the standard BC rudder so that it fit closer up against the hull bottom to catch more of the prop wash between the hull and the rudder.

    Because the bottom of the inside of the hull slopes and is otherwise contoured I couldn't just sit my printed mount by itself on the bottom. To make sure everything was level and aligned I used some JB Waterweld as a base and pushed the whole assembly down onto it nice and level like. The fiberglass hull was sanded first prior to applying the waterweld. This is a technique I had used in the Invincible and everything is still holding together but only more time will really tell how well it stays together.

    IMG_20180706_112510641.jpg

    Although I epoxied the gear onto a standard servo horn I didn't want anything coming apart when it mattered most so I drilled two holes through the gear itself and the servo horn underneath. I then CA glued a pair of small metal pins in as a back up. The rudder shaft also got a little white lithium grease and was flatted where the small gear set screw sits.

    IMG_20180705_142213345.jpg

    When I hooked the rudder servo up to my Rx with a power supply I was very happy with the results and can see why so many people use gears when space allows. There is a ton of throw and the rudder moves with no play and a lot of authority!

    That's it for today. Will hopefully get some more uploaded tomorrow.
     
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  5. NASAAN101

    NASAAN101 Well-Known Member

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    how big are the gears and were did you get them from!
    Nikki
     
  6. Litch42f

    Litch42f Well-Known Member

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    The one on the servo is 2" and the smaller one is 1". Both from Battler's Connection.
     
  7. NASAAN101

    NASAAN101 Well-Known Member

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    Nice. Found them :D now i just have to get them :D
    Nikki
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2018
  8. Litch42f

    Litch42f Well-Known Member

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    After the rudder set up was mostly complete I moved onto the prop and dummy shaft installation. My original plan was to do a mostly direct drive using the universal couplings. I 3D printed some discs the same diameter as my props and attached them to end of the of the drive shafts. Using double sided foam tape I built up a little pad near wear I wanted the props to sit (nice and close to the rudder). In the past I've just used the propellers themselves against the foam tape but discovered that one was not a perfect circle and thus one blade ended up touching the hull after everything was mounted. I also 3D printed a plate with two holes for the stuffing tubes that would keep the shafts spaced the distance I wanted them when I marked the hull for cutting. For future projects I'm going to combine the discs and spacer into one piece which I saw another builder do before.

    prop shaft jig.jpg

    In the above picture you can see my motor zip tied to its motor mount which I 3d printed using a file from the resources section. However, it seemed like the down angle was going to be too much and I also worried about the PLA mount melting since the motors I chose supposedly get pretty warm. So instead I tried making my own motor mounts but in the end I just didn't like the way they came out.

    IMG_20180328_113757097.jpg

    I decided to get some gear boxes from BC with the 380 size motor plate. I like them because they help keep the stuffing tubes low and straight as well as keeping the motors very secure. The original stuffing tubes from Strike were pretty short for how flat I wanted the shafts but I had some extra bushings laying around that pressed right into the gear boxes. After some aligning and sanding of the bottom of the gear boxes I finally got everything in place.

    IMG_20180525_115939433.jpg

    It runs really smooth and hopefully with my transmitter's throttle curve adjustments I will be able to get on speed easily enough. I flatted the shafts for the propeller, gear, and lock collar setscrews. When everything is close to finishing I'll re-install everything with blue loctite.

    Here are the propellers and rudder installed. It's hard to tell but there is some toe in towards the rudder and the props are about 1/8" apart.
    rudder throw.jpg
     
  9. NASAAN101

    NASAAN101 Well-Known Member

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    She's looking great! the more i look at the photos the more i'm chopping at the bit to get my savannah up :D but its hard cause i'm not working right now :'(
    Nikki
     
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  10. Litch42f

    Litch42f Well-Known Member

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    Lots of work has been completed on the Phoenix over the last week.

    Pet screen armor has been installed along with a bb proof divider in the narrow area of the bow. To hold the divider and also prevent water from settling in the bow I used some Free Form Air epoxy dough (the lighter version). At the moment I don't plan on doing any further water channeling other than this as the hull is fairly rounded. If I discover some unfavorable sinking characteristics later on I'll re-evaluate.
    IMG_20180627_120334452.jpg

    Work has commenced on installing the dual stern guns. I really wanted to be able to make small elevation adjustments so I got to work designing a 3D printed mounting solution. After several attempts I think I came up with something that worked along with a good barrel holder design (thanks to Panzer).

    IMG_20180705_114620098.jpg

    IMG_20180628_152319742.jpg

    The deck hold downs can also be seen in the above picture. They're just pieces of brass with a screw/nut holding them to the deck. Also:
    -Dummy shafts are in and drag disks installed
    -Waterweld was used to streamline the stuffing tubes into the hull
    -Stuffing tube supports installed. The live shafts go through the hull and are epoxied. The dummy shafts just got glued to the hull.
    -The pet screen armor was mounted to a rib backer every other rib.

    Other things that got worked on included the superstructure along with the recovery float.
    IMG_20180705_142548752.jpg

    IMG_20180712_094139743.jpg
    Underneath the funnel is the same 3D printed spool I used on my Invincible. To prevent bbs from knocking the funnel with my float away I drilled a small hole in the funnel base and inserted some music wire that got safety wired to the top of the funnel. I'm hoping it will keep the funnel from going overboard and also adds to the superstructure detail. Blast shields got 3D printed so when they inevitably get blasted off I can print a new one.

    Some electronics work was also completed. I'm using the BC cruiser board, BC test switches, and the Hobbywing 60A ESC can be seen as well. The test switch board and Cruiser board got a coat of E6000. The ESC and cruiser board sit in a 3D printed tray that has legs that will keep them mostly dry unless a sink occurs.

    IMG_20180705_115017380.jpg IMG_20180705_115118926.jpg
     
  11. Litch42f

    Litch42f Well-Known Member

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    Work continues on the Phoenix and she is getting close to sea trials.

    Got the balsa prepped with one side of silkspan and cut for its location on the hull. In the past I've used CA glue to adhere the balsa to the hull but after using this technique on the Invincible she had a few small leaks coming from the sides. This time I used the Weldwood contact cement and was a lot happier with the application process at least.

    IMG_20180712_103646036.jpg

    IMG_20180712_104843549.jpg

    I got all my panels on and sanded down the ends and seams. Got the layer of silkspan applied to the outside of the hull as well.

    IMG_20180713_090743298.jpg

    A lot of the superstructure has been completed as well.

    The stern guns have gotten some good testing and seem to work fairly well. The only issue I had is that my test switches seem to have developed a problem. For every 3-4 depressions of the test switch the gun will only fire once. Previously this wasn't a problem as I had tested the switches before and after the E6000 coating. Using my radio to trigger the solenoids and everything works fine.

    IMG_20180713_090836303.jpg

    Also got the safety pin hold downs completed with 9" wire fishing leaders.

    The base coat and bottom paint have been applied.

    IMG_20180720_112752452.jpg

    Now I just need to organize the internals and run some plumbing and wiring. Also need to add ballast as necessary to get to my waterline. At the moment she weighs about 1lb under my target final weight.

    I told my wife the pool was for the dogs but we all know what its really for...

    IMG_20180728_123635226.jpg
     
  12. Beaver

    Beaver 2020 Rookie of the Year Admiral (Supporter)

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    Nice work! :)
     
  13. Panzer

    Panzer Iron Dog Shipwerks and CiderHaus

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    Excellent work! everything looks great. keep it coming.
    Craig
     
  14. Renodemona

    Renodemona Well-Known Member

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    Don't forget to cover those barrels with tubing (the stuff used for pump outlets is the perfect size) or they will get dinged and stop passing bbs. It also gives you a nice surface to write gun names on.
     
  15. RcShip556

    RcShip556 Member

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    That’s super cool
     
  16. kgaigalas

    kgaigalas Well-Known Member

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    Two battery options
    Both are 10 amp hrs.
    6v
     

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  17. Litch42f

    Litch42f Well-Known Member

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    Well it looks like the Phoenix is about ready for sea trials. I finally got most of my internals where I wanted them while still keeping the boat well balanced. Let's start near the bow:

    Phoenix bow.jpg

    The 2.8 oz. bottle sits in a 3D printed cradle with a nice up angle. It is also Velcro'd to its cradle in the event of a near or complete inversion. The reason I have it pointed towards the stern is because that ended up being the easiest way to be able to remove the regulator and extract the bottle. The BC lightweight regulator has two primary supply lines plumbed off of it with one for each BC solenoid. Some wheel weights from Harbor Freight helped with the ballast. Aft and underneath the regulator is the battery tray. At the moment the ship is powered by a 6v 5 AH SLA. I know I said I was going to try new battery chemistry but since the Phoenix will be primarily running back up I decided to stick with the SLA for now.

    Moving further aft:

    Phoenix electrical.jpg Phoenix midship.jpg

    Right behind the battery tray is the electronics tray (also 3D printed). It sits about 3/4" above the bottom to hopefully keep it out of most of the water. The BC Cruiser board is coated with E6000 and the Hobbywing 60A ESC comes waterproofed. The RX is mounted under a cross member to keep it dry for the majority of the time, but also E6000 coated. The test switches can be seen as well. They still fire intermittently but they work well enough to test individual guns. The bilge pump is sitting in a 3D printed cradle designed by one the other forum members as I had pulled it from the resources section. The magazines got their protective sleeve.

    On to the stern:

    Phoenix stern.jpg

    BB collector magnets were added to the bilge areas. The BC solenoids are actually zip tied to 380 motor mounts (also from the resources section). I got some of the quick disconnects from BC as well to keep the solenoid-to-gun air line relatively short.

    I know I don't have many step by step pictures. I find that when I get into a building groove I forget to stop and take progress pics.

    Anyways, I just need to do some final ballasting and stick the waterline on. The guns have been pretty well tested and I think having the individual air supply lines from the regulator is keeping up with the demand of the dual sterns. In the doggie pool I've completed some driveline tests. Everything seems to run well. I had to back down the rudder throw because with an almost 90 degree throw it was loosing turning capability. In the heat of the battle I jam the rudder control over so I don't want to have to worry about that.

    Phoenix overall.jpg

    SCRAP has a sanctioned battle this weekend so I'm hoping at a minimum to do some good sea trials. If everything goes well Phoenix may enter an afternoon sortie.
     
  18. SteveT44

    SteveT44 Well-Known Member

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    Nice craftsmanship on display.
     
  19. Renodemona

    Renodemona Well-Known Member

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    Looking good! You guys have a good battle this weekend and stay cool!
     
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  20. Litch42f

    Litch42f Well-Known Member

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    USS Phoenix post battle report:

    So we made it down to Chino in record time and pulled into the lake at 0900 after departing Vegas at 0445. It was a light crew today with only three other operable ships in attendance, all cruisers. The Invincible would be ready but last time I had to deal with only cruisers I didn't fare so well. Anyways, I got the Phoenix gassed and loaded and plopped it in the water for some test runs before official battle was to be joined at 1000.

    Right off the bat she was too slow so I did some throttle curve tweaking and got her close to the 23 second mark. She also rolled a lot when I would push the rudder hard over at high speed, but from a stop she turned far better than I expected. Mental note: get some weight lower in the hull and probably bilge keels. The dual sterns seemed to be in good working order and I emptied the magazines before finishing her test run. The other slight issue was that my bilge pump motor was oscillating RPMs on it own for some reason and I worried that this was a sign of imminent failure. I told the CD I would probably run the Invincible but everyone watching my test run thought she was good enough to participate, especially as everyone else had a cruiser. So back to the bench for a reload and final systems check.

    HDV_0443_Moment.jpg

    The first battle for the day would be Axis vs. Allies, two cruisers per fleet. By the end of the second sortie the Phoenix was still going strong and everything was still operational. I was able to get the dual sterns on target a few times and avoided incoming fire, only one hit above the waterline recorded after the first battle.
    HDV_0442_Moment2.jpg

    The first sortie of the afternoon battle quickly revealed a system failure. Shortly after the commencement of battle my drive system developed an unsavory rattle of sorts. My initial though was that a motor had come loose and the lashing on the gears was causing the racket. I still had what appeared to be full drive capability so I tried to quickly find targets for my bbs and call 5. Once I got her out of the water I discovered that the motor was still securely fastened to the gearbox and the lashing was fine. The propeller still turned by hand so now I assumed an internal motor issue. A drive test on the bench showed that the port shaft would only spin at close to full throttle. Although I had a spare motor I decided to sortie on the one operable shaft and see how she did. Trial by fire, right?

    HDV_0442_Moment.jpg

    Although my speed and turning capability were reduced, I was able to empty my magazine and avoid any catastrophic damage. Everyone else had emptied their magazines as well so we pulled them for the day. Damage for the second battle on the Phoenix was 9 above and 1 on. I didn't have to use the bilge pump much but it still turned on every time I called for it despite its earlier hesitation.

    Overall I was very impressed with the Phoenix's first outing.

    The next day I took the port motor off and found that the sleeve that thickens the small 380 shaft for an 1/8" pinion gear had become unsoldered and that was my failure. I do remember having trouble getting these sleeves to stay well attached during building and testing so I'm not surprised this happened. This time I'm going to just try CA glue and see how it does. Otherwise I've gotten started on my bilge keels...

    PHX bilge keels.jpg
     

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