HSwMS Gotland

Discussion in 'Warship Builds' started by notSoGnarly, Jan 4, 2022.

  1. notSoGnarly

    notSoGnarly Well-Known Member

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    I've been looking for a first ship to build and I've settled on at a minimum, designing a HSwMS Gotland. I was looking for something on the small side (<40" LOA) but wanted to stay away from class 1 ships. After sorting and grouping the shiplist this way and that, I found the HSwMS Gotland.
    • Class: 2
    • Battle Units: 2
    • Speed: 22
    • Beam: 4.25"
    • LOA: 36.83"
    Pros / Reasons (Total rookie POV here)
    • 36.83" LOA means it fits in the backseat of a Honda Civic.
    • Wider and heavier than other ships this length.
    • 2 units beats 1.5 units for the same 21/22 speed.
    • Basic hull. No stringers.
    • Neutral ship (I saw some chatter on neutral ships being able to flex axis/ally as needed).
    • She's a "Flygpanskryssare" - a Seaplane Cruiser. A very unique design concept that only made sense for a couple decades. I served on a CVN aircraft carrier and the naval aviation history here is hard not to love.
    • I get to whisper into british captains ears that I saw the Bismark break out.
      • The Gotland was the ship that first spotted the Bismark on May 20th 1941.
    • Unique ship.
    Cons:
    • Unique ship.
    • It's going to be a tight fit but I have some great local resources here in the SAS.

    I watched bsgkid117 's Fusion 360 tutorial on using 2D plans to build superstructure parts. GREAT RESOURCE, I have not touched anything 3D design for 15+ years. I downloaded Fusion360 and spent a couple hours after work getting the plans I had bookmarked lined up and scaled correctly. Now I need to watch some tutorials on how to actually build things and I'll be smooth sailing. I don't know the last time I spent off-work time on a computer doing something this much fun.

    Plans from Warship International
     

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    Last edited: Jan 5, 2022
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  2. darkapollo

    darkapollo Well-Known Member

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    And… following.

    That is quite the interesting choice of a first ship. I would love to see it on the water.

    If you need ANY help with designing, or figuring something out in Fusion, there are several of us that would love to help. All you need to do is ask!
     
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  3. notSoGnarly

    notSoGnarly Well-Known Member

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    Thank you! I've got a lot to learn and the group here has already been a great resource. I'm reading through some forums and picking up tips. Advice is always welcome!

    I figured why not really go from scratch. I know it sounds counter productive but I'm trying to not strive for perfection as Will recommended. I want to focus on the basic shape first before I get bogged down in the details.
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2022
  4. Kotori87

    Kotori87 Well-Known Member

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    Do you have good rib sections? If not, you'll have to develop your own and that can be a tricky proposition.
     
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  5. Renodemona

    Renodemona Well-Known Member

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    Unless you arm the bow turret or casemates you will run into some space issues fitting the guns, that "stern" turret is in a really awkward spot and has pretty terrible sight lines as a stern gun. Now, a 1 unit gun in a bow casemate and a 1/2 unit in the other, that might be kind of fun and keep the magazines out of the way. Looking forward to seeing your progress!
     
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  6. notSoGnarly

    notSoGnarly Well-Known Member

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    I got a solid start with this rib calculator but as of right now...don't even have a hull shape. So I figured I'll start there.
     

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  7. notSoGnarly

    notSoGnarly Well-Known Member

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    I've been looking at that stern gun as an interesting one for sure. With a ship this small, if I point the stern canon straight aft my barrel will be laying just over the catapult. While not an ideal firing position IRL, it doesn't seem like it will function different than other long stern cruiser guns. I figure I don't need much of a down angle when I'm going to be so close to the water.

    Of course all this is pencil sketch at the moment. Once I get the basic 3D model built I will have a better idea of what can fit where. My initial thought on the casemate guns is that arming them may cause a balance issue?

    I'm interpreting the rules on 15° port or stbd from the longitudinal line to mean from the turret not from the stern. (Is that correct?) That plus the rule stating one can mount canons in the superstructure if the turret is to small. I feel like I have just enough wiggle room, determination, and help from the community that a rear mount is possible.
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2022
  8. bsgkid117

    bsgkid117 Vendor

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    There is an available Tromp-class hull, if you wanted to save yourself a ton of time and effort. But I do understand the desire to do a project "just because".

    Tromp can be built quite easily with a stern gun vs the issues outlined above with this ship's gun placement.
     
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  9. notSoGnarly

    notSoGnarly Well-Known Member

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    The one from model ships ahoy?
    That was one my list as a possible. But the extra .5 unit and 1" wider beam pushed me toward Gotland.
    I haven't asked it aloud but is it even possible to widen a fiberglass hull? It sounds like a lot of work but this is all new to me.
     
  10. darkapollo

    darkapollo Well-Known Member

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    Yes, you can. It takes some work, but it is just like patching fiberglass.

    @Beaver is building a Tromp and I made a super structure for him for it. So that is also an option, as Will stated.
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2022
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  11. notSoGnarly

    notSoGnarly Well-Known Member

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    Interesting. So technically my options for construction are wood, 3D print, and modifying a fiberglass Tromp hull by adding an inch to the beam. Plenty to think on.
     
  12. darkapollo

    darkapollo Well-Known Member

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  13. notSoGnarly

    notSoGnarly Well-Known Member

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    Oh yeah I stared at that model for a while, it's gorgeous . I think those are the best shots of the hull out there.

    They're a few f360 tutorials on shaping hulls that I plan on getting to in the next couple days. I think you're right, that model will be an ideal reference. Or I could just go see this beauty in person. Just short hop over the pond :laugh:.
     
  14. kgaigalas

    kgaigalas Well-Known Member

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    I am concerned about stern gun placement.
    In a class 2 you can have 3 - 1/2 unit guns + 1/2 pump
    or a 1.5 unit gun + 1/2 pump
    (any combination of same)
    One gun reduces weight
    I do not know how much detail you want on the back deck.
    My Washington has a lot of stuff on the back deck that is not on my model
    I have also seen guys shoot their stern guns THROUGH there superstructure.
     
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  15. notSoGnarly

    notSoGnarly Well-Known Member

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    The stern gun placement has been my biggest ?? since I decided to start the design phase. I have a lot of thoughts on it but no experience.

    The estimate I did on my f360 plans is that if I mounted the stern canon in the turret and used a 5" barrel there will be 8.47 inches of deck to cover before the BBs are over water. Idk what kind of trajectory there is in 9 inches but my gut says very little drop? The turret sits just above the aft deck* and a 5" barrel does clear the rotating catapult, but again, 8.5 inches of deck left. Luckily, if I want some little Osperys on there they can be affixed to the sides like they were on the real ship.

    I do want to find the balance between the "spirit of the game" and the accuracy of the model. Shooting through a superstructure seems...like a (haze) grey area. I don't want to angle down and shoot through the flight deck. That seems way to far from the accuracy of the model. Right now I'm going to cross my fingers that we can get away with just clearing that 8.5 inches with a shallow angle and be able to hit the water soon after due to the short freeboard. But I'm open to all thoughts here for sure and you are correct the 4 forward guns gives me flexibility.

    *(From our rules I can't figure out what to call it since it's not a step down from the weather deck. I might just settle on flight deck because, well, that's what it is.)
     
  16. notSoGnarly

    notSoGnarly Well-Known Member

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    On your Washington whats the distance from stern gun to stern?
     

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  17. kgaigalas

    kgaigalas Well-Known Member

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    The distance from the END of my 5" barrels to the end of the back deck
    8.75"
     
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  18. notSoGnarly

    notSoGnarly Well-Known Member

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    (Good correction on that measurement)
    You have them pointed as sides or sterns? I'm assuming stern since you had that measurement handy lol.

    Seems like a similar engineering opportunity. But I bet you have more elevation than my mount.
     
  19. kgaigalas

    kgaigalas Well-Known Member

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  20. Kotori87

    Kotori87 Well-Known Member

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    Wow, that is a pretty simple shape to model. You'll probably get a lot of mileage out of two lines and an arc. The example below is a sketch of a half-rib for my Mikasa hull, modeled in Fusion360. Don't worry about the stuff inside, just look at the outside shape. It's literally a deck, two lines, and an arc connecting the two lines. Almost all of Mikasa's ribs are like this, all I did was vary the length and angle of the lines, and the radius of the arc. The forward ribs slope inward instead of out, and the arc has a smaller radius. For the aft ribs, the bottom line angles upwards. I just fiddled with the numbers until the CAD model matched my plans.
    Rib.jpg
    In cases where you don't have enough rib profiles to match, you eyeball a few "keyframe" ribs and then do a little math to smoothly transition between the keyframes. It's a very old technique I learned from the master wooden hull builders in the WWCC many years ago.
     
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